crossposted from DK. Comments might be of interest.


Yes, this is another great opportunity to express your opinions. What do you think about banning?

I’ll admit I kinda have some issues about banning, having suffered some social ostracizing myself over the decades.

It sucks. And generally the outliers get it the worst, because we are the most confusing.

And the older we are, the longer we’ve been dealing with being confusing, and the more we’ve been ostracized, the more generally cranky we tend to have become.

So it goes round and round, and down and down.

I don’t think I’d like to have a job that involved banning people. I think it would make me crazy. And I’m already crazy.

It is one of the worst possible things you can do to someone who has become identified with a community, banning them.

Making them non-persons. Pretending they don’t exist any more.

Attacking people for even bringing them up, the banned people.

The Omelas people.

The ones in the cage.

Fortunately, the banned can go to other blogs. But it’s generally considered by people on other blogs, that this is the hub for “progressive” blogging, whatever that means anymore.

This is the winnowing place. It’s like a gated city, in a way, with the roaming volunteer cops and all these caveats, these linguistic covenants.

I’m not writing this post to tell any of you what to do. Au contraire. I’m writing it about what I observe people here doing. About what I’ve experienced.

And also, just to ask y’all, where you think this should go, all this banning and fighting about language and going around trolling for trolls (because yes, that’s exactly what happens here).

There are some big conflicts here. One is about war escalation.

The IGTNT people rock, imho. Since we’re in the wars, it’s good and kind to comfort the bereaved. I’ve been really impressed by how the people who work those posts handle doing so. Bigtime.

But I stop there with it. We have to stop warring. We have to stop letting the corporations run our politicians and then our politicians running us. We have to stop letting them set us against each other.

That’s part of why I refer to the IGTNT people here, because they get it. They get how to deal with conflict and pain and anger.

They understand it viscerally. And yeah; you can say they are glorifying the Army or something that, but that’s not really what’s going on there.

I don’t even hang out in the IGTNT essays. But I know what they’re doing. Because there is only one thing to honestly do, when confronting the bereaved, and unnecessary death, and kids getting killed.

Only one thing to do. Have your heart broken, that’s the only thing to do.

So, how about we figure out how to stop all this warring? On all these levels.

We cannot win unless we stop fighting.

Happy Solstice, everybody.




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    • Miep on December 22, 2009 at 06:05
    • TMC on December 22, 2009 at 06:18

    over at Dkos were exactly what I expected. They keep banning the left and let the purity trolls run amok. Fine. It’s all theirs.  

    • Miep on December 22, 2009 at 06:28

    on naranja:

    you, too, might be interested in my suggesting that NOBODY EVER GETS BANNED

    but instead, the rules are more clearly stated, and the worst thing that happens is you get suspended for six months.

    I HATE banning. I think it’s the shittiest thing you can ever do to a person. Make them a non-person.


    Maybe I should have entitled this essay that.

    This has been a really good discussion. I think we can work with this, if the admins listen.

    Sure, there are some times when user ID’s should be stopped in their tracks..obvious spam garbage, or really sick bigotry.

    But other than that,

    fuck banning.  The hell with it.

    Let us talk. Let us argue. Let us give each other nine kinds of hell, without having to keep worrying about all this fear about being thrown out of the tribe.

    Let us be free to talk, and yell, and have fits at times.

    We NEED to be able to do that.

    Thanks, drache. Thanks, all of you.

    Power to the people and free speech too.

    Let’s do it.


  1. lil perfect serious world.

    they sold their souls for seriousness.

    But, here… WE HAVE A VOICE.

    • Miep on December 22, 2009 at 06:53

    …the TUs would first have to prove that they would be willing to call out the misbehavior of the people they most agreed with on the site. We have too much of a double-standard in this regard – with people HRing their political enemies for doing things they uprate their political pals for doing.

  2. But it aint that bad, heaven aint all it’s cracked up to be.  

    • Miep on December 22, 2009 at 07:37

    I am going to help, and you are going to knock this shit off.

    Or you won’t. I’m not the regulator. I’m not the controller.

    I’m the lover. I know this is hard.

    I have a plan, I have an agenda.

    Quit fighting with each other. That’s wrong. I love you all.

    We’ve GOT to get it together.

    we’ve got to get out of this place, if it’s the last thing we ever do.

    • Miep on December 22, 2009 at 08:39

    Geez, this has been a hard row to hoe.

    Love you Dharma Bums, but I’ve about had it with this discussion.

    Edger? Catfish?


    save the country

    • Miep on December 22, 2009 at 08:40

    • Inky99 on December 22, 2009 at 09:08

    Everybody here needs to get over Dailykos.

    As some of you know, I went back there out of sheer boredom a while back when I was unemployed and had a really bad cold.   I wanted to just uprate a few things and maybe give some supportive comments.

    Now, I don’t know how many of you have ever sorta made an attempt to get back together with someone with whom you’ve broken up?   Well, right away you realize everything you liked about the person AND everything that drove you nuts.  It’s like you relive the entire relationship in about five minutes.

    Anyway, Dailykos is dead.  It’s dead.

    We all need to move on.   It ain’t gonna change back to the way it used to be when we liked it.  

    We need to accept that and get over it and move on.

    Myself included.   Although my last time going back wasn’t to try to do what I used to do there — that was the last straw, when they banned Inky99, because, hell, I’d contributed a lot to that site, and was in fact playing by their rules and didn’t actually state anything that wasn’t 100% factual — and they banned me anyway.   Along with one of the best bloggers I’ve seen, TDV.  

    So I said back then, “fuck them”.   And I meant it, and that’s how it was.   But this place, and the other couple of places I go, can be kinda slow.   You go to Dailykos and jump into the fray, there’s some serious action.   You get sucked in.  Even if it’s bad energy, it’s energy, and as much as you want usually.

    But it’s time to let that place die the death that has already occurred.

    Who cares about banning at Dailykos?   I mean, really.  They get what they deserve over there.

    They are no different now than Sarah Palin fans.  

    That’s how they want it there, and that’s how it is.

    R.I.P. Dailykos.

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