Fire and Brimstone

( – promoted by buhdydharma )

I’ve learned the hard way that it’s impossible to sway RePug “Christians” with fact-based arguments about health care reform or anything else.  They don’t care about facts.  They won’t believe a word a liberal tells them, they won’t believe what scientists say about global warming, they won’t believe Obama was born in Hawaii, they won’t believe that Limbaugh and Hannity and Beck are lying to them about health care reform and everything else.  

But they believe the Bible.

Verily, my experience said unto me, the only way to have any chance at all of penetrating the thick skulls of Republican “Christians” in my state is to grab a Bible and beat them over the head with it.  

So . . . I grabbed a Bible and beat them over the head with it.

Letter to the Editor: What Would Jesus Do About Health Care Reform?

Jesus taught us to have compassion for one another, to help the sick and the poor among us.  Liberals have always tried to do that, they believe we all have a moral responsibility to help those in need, not only as individuals, but as a society.  President Obama and liberal Democrats are trying to ensure that everyone in America can have access to health care when they need it.  They want to help those in need.  They’re doing what Jesus taught us to do.  

But what has been the response of Republicans?  Angry bellowing about socialism.  Threats of violence against the President of the United States.  Lies that President Obama wants to euthanize everyone’s grandmother. Disgusting townhall spectacles of Republicans demanding their free speech rights while shouting down everyone else who tries to speak.  

Health care reform is not a political issue, it’s a moral issue.  Helping those in need is not a political issue, it’s a moral issue.  I’m not telling you that.  Jesus is telling you that.  I would advise every Republican in this country who claims to be a Christian to heed what Jesus said in Matthew 25:41-45: “Whatever you did not do for the least among you, you did not do for me.”

If Republicans continue to ignore the teachings of Jesus, if Republicans continue to demonize liberals for wanting to help those in need, if Republicans continue to protect the rich and blame the poor for their poverty, Republicans will hear these words from Jesus on Judgment Day: “Depart from me, you who are cursed.  For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and you did not look after me.”

You have a choice to make, Republicans.  You can keep listening to the lies of Limbaugh and Hannity and Beck, or you can start listening to the Son of God.

RePug “Christians” don’t want to be told they’ll be cast into the Lake of Fire for turning their backs on the poor and the powerless.  Well I’m not the one telling them that, their own God is telling them that.  I don’t know if Jesus is the Son of God, I don’t know if Hell exists, but I know this: every time RePug “Christians” don’t like the message, they blame the messenger.   Well here’s the messenger, RePug “Christians” . . .  

Jesus Crown of Thorns Pictures, Images and Photos

Before he was tortured and executed for speaking truth to power, that Son of God RePug “Christians” claim they believe in said we should help those in need, he said we should love our enemies, he said we should turn our swords into plowshares.  But RePug “Christians” won’t do any of that.  They turn their backs on the poor and the powerless.  They hate everyone who disagrees with them.  They say they love the Prince of Peace, but they glorify war, they sanctify torture, they crucify the truth.  They are torturers, they are hypocrites, they are liars, they live and breathe deceit.  

If you want to know who the AntiChrist is, RePug “Christians”, look in the mirror.  


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  1. they don’t understand Luke 6:41

    And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but perceivest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

  2. oh Im itchin’ to dive into this essay but Im not gonna have much time til tomorrow probably.

    I have this one sister, uber-xtian, she and I have had some very deep talks over the years. She’s certainly not the sterotype Palinite type, but… its interesting. She has helped me have a better perspective on them though.

    She sent me this book, over a year ago, The Shack. Its apparently kind of a huge underground hit with that crowd. Very interesting, gives some insight into their POV.

    Theyre not really into hate, but their Fear is very…. uhm… deep.

    • Alma on August 12, 2009 at 2:07 am

    I think this might be your best letter yet.  Devilishly clever!  🙂

  3. First, I’m not a Christian and can’t even understand the Bible when I try to read it.  I don’t like Republicans or Democrats.  

    You are right.  Healthcare needs some fixing, but this is not the way.  If your car starts squealing real loud when you turn the wheel, do you start taking the bus or do you replace the power steering belt and check the fluid?

    I sure hope you know what you’re talking about when you bring the Bible into this.  I haven’t read it and have a hard time understanding it, so I’ll just take your word for it.

    Rusty, have you read the healthcare bill?  Our congressmen haven’t.  There are your facts.  You tell me what it says.  I suggest you read my blog post at http://thefirstcitizen.wordpre

    “Healthcare Bill Verification: Etc…

    Then read the bill for yourself and formulate your own opinion.  

    There is something that deeply concerns about your statement, “Disgusting town hall spectacles of Republicans demanding their free speech rights while shouting down everyone else who tries to speak.”  First of all, get the facts straight.  Who is shouting down everyone else?  Have you been to a town hall meeting?  Have you watched the videos posted on the internet?  What I saw was a man beaten down by men wearing SEIU t-shirts, healthcare supporters, while he was selling some flags.  We all need to be careful about where we point our fingers.  Take the reports you hear and do your own research to make sure you are not being misled.  Don’t ask a liar if he’s lying.

    The other concern is about “demanding their free speech rights…”  I sure hope you’re not suggesting that people stop speaking out.  

    Tell me if this makes sense.  Some have claimed that the conservatives have been organized by the insurance companies, plotting, and sabotaging the town meetings.  These people who oppose this bill have EMPLOYER provided health insurance.  Which means thses people have jobs and work at least 40 hrs/wk M-F 8-5, have families, cook dinner, fix dinner, laundry, etc..  They don’t have time to organize.  They are however speaking out when it’s important.  

    My other point here has to do with your reference to the Bible in support of HELPING the poor and less fortunate.  Isn’t there some verbiage in the Bible about how one must help himself?  I’d like to focus on a clearly understand what it means by “HELP”.  It says “HELP”, not “take responsibility for.” Have you ever helped a friend fix his car, roof his house, repair plumbing, study for a test, etc?  Did you help him do it or did you do it for him.  I know there is a story about fishing.  I believe it goes, “Give a man a fish and feed him for a day, teach a man to fish and feed him for a life time.”  I’m pretty sure the story doesn’t say, “Feed the man for the rest of his life while he plays XBOX and watches Law and Order every night.”  

    Now here is the kicker.  Please show me proof that I, Beck, Limbaugh, Hannity, etc…  are wrong.  Because our president has yet to do so.  The current healthcare proposal will take away your freedoms.  It only makes sense.  If I have to pay for your healthcare, then I think I should get to tell you what to eat, maintain a body weight, no drugs, no alcohol, you must exercise and run a 6 min mile, etc…  

    Now, I don’t believe that I should be able to tell you what to do and how to do it.  I believe that you should be free to make your own choices.  Make no mistake; you are solely responsible for consequences of those choices.  If you want to sit on a couch, eat McDonalds, drink, smoke, and die from lung cancer or a heart attack before you’re 45, you are free to do so.  But don’t ask me or anyone else to pay for it.

    Use some common sense.  There is warranted concern here for the following reasons.  

    1) Congress has not read the bill.

    2) Something this large should never be rushed and it has.

    3) It’s 1000 pages, too complicated to understand, too complicated to work.

    You read the Constitution, read about the founding principles of creating our free nation, and then you tell me if this is socialism or not.  In fact, start with the definitions of socialism, capitalism, freedom, tyranny, republic, and democracy in the dictionary.  Educate yourself first.  Then we’ll talk.

    Citizen Paine

    The First Citizen

  4. Well done as usual!

  5. This was a post from article that was commented on CNN’s website.


    As a medical doctor on the front lines let me provide two questions to some of the craziness followed by comments: 1) Has the government ran anything that works right, 2) Are the two current government ran health care programs (medicaid-state/federal, Medicare- federal) financially stable.

    I think regardless if your are dem or rep, you can name several programs that have failed under government control. Furthermore, in my state medicaid is broke and for those less than 40 forget medicare it wont be there. So, forget the death squad bull and the government is out to get you statements. Bottom line, how in the world will the US government run healthcare when it can not run itself.

    Something clearly needs to be done no arguement but doing it right is what is important. If your dem. putting a feather in your hat for politcal gain is noble but you do not have to live with the mistake and if your rep. being a part of the problem rather than the solution is like a little kid taking their ball and bat and going home–GROW UP.

    So, if you want to know what is working and not working than ask a doctor in primary care. We will tell you. We have to deal with the person without insurance but need to get them hypertensive medications. I have memorized the Walmart $4 dollar list by heart.

    Just for the record: In my state it takes 6 months to get an Ortho doctor to see you, 4 months to get you into Endocrinology, do not even think about going to a dermatologist and if your deaf/medicaid oh my am I going to get an earful from the doctor that I referred you to because they didnt make any money. Furthermore, I have restriction on what I can do and not do under both systems private and government ran health care.

    I went into primary care knowing that I would not make big bucks but really wanted to really be a part of helping others be healthy. Instead, I am filling out forms to justify the medication that I prescibe and why it is medically necessary. Can you believe it, went to 4 years of medical school and 3 years residency to write down that I really think this is medically necessary before the patient can get the prescription filled. Lord help the person if they have more than 5 prescriptions, I have to sign over my 1st born for that one.

    But its going to get better under a government ran system. No red tape just uninsured people getting health care. Yea- right.

  6. Goes straight to the gut of the matter.  There never, ever has been enough said about the rights’ faux religious  posturing, their facade, laden with venom and hatred.  Hypocrites it not really a strong enough word for people who use religion, vehicularly, to convey their false, empty and hate-filled messages.

    “Do Unto Others as You Would Have Others Do Unto You.”

  7. currently under consideration, as Dave Lindorff, points out:

    A Few More Thoughts About Single-Payer and Medicare


    Some critics have written, in response to my article calling for extension of the single-payer plan called Medicare to all Americans, that actually Medicare is a badly flawed program that leaves America’s elderly without coverage for many important health services, and which requires them to pay for supplemental insurance, or to go on Medicaid, too.

    These critics are correct. Medicare is great as far as it goes. It is simple for people to use, allows them to go to the doctors of their choice, covers 80 percent of their care, and is liked by nearly all who use it. But it doesn’t pay for needed tests, only lets seniors buy mediocre medical devices like hearing aids, and most importantly, it has been requiring more and more contributions by the elderly year after year. Today, Americans over 65 and the permanently disabled pay a greater percentage of their income for medical care than they did in 1964 before Medicare was established!

    But having said that, I have to say that it has nothing to do with whether or not it makes sense to expand Medicare to all Americans as a way to solve our health care crisis–as Rep. John Conyers’ bill, HR 676, would do.

    The reason Medicare is inadequate is because the Republicans and the conservative Democrats–the very “Blue Dog” vermin who, engorged on health insurance, hospital and pharmacy bribes and campaign donations, are undermining and destroying the already lousy health care “reform” plan of President Barack Obama–have been underfunding it, and performing a slow “privatization” of the program, chipping away at its benefits, adding increased self-pay requirements, and raising the Medicare tax on all workers. . . . .

    The so-called “reform” bill that is going to emerge from the current process is going to be the legislative equivalent of road kill, barely recognizeable either as health care or as a “reform.” It will be a Christmas present for the insurance industry, the hospital industry and the phramaceutical industry, all three of which struck secret deals behind closed doors with the White House.

    It will set back health reform in America a generation, will require everyone to buy inadequate and overpriced insurance, overpriced drugs and to go to overpriced hospitals. And the cost of healthcare to individuals, businesses, and the nation as a whole (already the highest in the modern industrial world), will continue to soar.

    This is not a case where the right thing to do is push for any bill, and then try to move on. This is a case where Obama and the Democrats have whored themselves out to the greedy industry that is causing all the problems, and are pushing a plan that is worse than nothing.

    We should all be working to kill this whole thing and start over, with HR 676.

    If Congress won’t do it, we need to start working for a new Congress in 2010 that will.

    No Democrat running for House or Senate in 2010 who isn’t solidly for expanding Medicare to all should get a single vote.

    Unfortunately, I think there is so much truth in Lindorff’s analyse of the proposed healthcare reform, as it is so called.

  8. terms of healthcare:

  9. ‘Dear Michael Moore, We Read Rolling Stone’

    – Republican National Committee

    Michael Moore Responds

    Dear GOP:

    That is so cool! I knew you guys were more than just all Lee Greenwood and Pat Boone. Let me expand on my remarks.

    You see, Obama is LeBron and you are the Clippers. The Clippers know that LeBron is going to fake right and go left, but it doesn’t matter – they’re still the Clippers and he’s LeBron and he’s going to make the basket. Even if he shouted at the Clippers as he’s coming down the court, “Hey, I’m gonna fake right and go left when I get to the basket,” they still aren’t going to stop him. And you, the GOP, are not going to stop Obama and you are not going to stop the will of the American people. Just as the Clippers can somehow still get thousands to come see them play, you are able to pack town hall meetings with your fans. Good on you! Keep it up!

    Now, what do you know about Obama’s hook shot?

    – Michael Moore

  10. I am posting this to all of you since I am being engaged in a discussion by most of you who have posted lately.  I’m really not sure what to say first.  Well, I guess the first thing to address is “who am I?”  I’m not going to give my name, address, phone number, etc…  If you read my blog and read the links under “About Me” on the right-hand side, you’ll know who I am. Regardless if you believe it or not, that’s me without giving up my identity.

    Since you’ve asked and have drawn some of your own theories, such as NSA, FBI, etc…  I’ll elaborate a little more.  Now, honestly, I actually thought about playing into your NSA idea and make some BS story about my new dept spear heading the blogging community, blah, blah, blah, just see what you’re reactions would be.  However, I’m just a guy, a citizen, and I know this next statement will probably drive you crazy, but I’m just like you.  We obviously see things from different perspectives and have different beliefs, and that’s ok.  That’s what America is, or should be about.  I’m sorry to disappoint you with the truth that I’m not NSA, FBI, or any such thing.  I’ve actually been politically sleeping, until recently.  When I heard the rumors of what was going on, I started paying attention.  Rusty will tell you I’m an idiot, and even if he’s right, I’m smart enough not to believe everything I read or hear without verifying it myself from at least one other source.  In addition, as I learn who is taking the opposing position on the same issue, I reference their reports, postings, etc…  What I have been finding is continuing to get more and more disturbing.  I’m not faking it either, it’s 2:30 in the morning and I’ve been up every night this week until 1 – 3 am and usually don’t fall asleep until 3 – 4.  I’m self employed and have a family to feed.  The point is I’m genuinely concerned and worried about what lies ahead.  I’m up now because of a some information that I hope to God is not true and I am completely wrong.  Yet, the thoughts are keeping me up.  

    So, why am I on your blog?  As I started paying attention, I began to reaffirm what I believe in.  It then became clear to me that I had to do something.  Here’s the premise or underlying thought I had.  People have different ideas.  The world, events, structures, infrastructures, society, all develop from ideas.  Everything begins with a thought.  You don’t do anything without thinking about it first, right?  So, I have an idea that differs from yours.  I present my idea to you.  You question or challenge my idea and explain why.  (Or if you’re Rusty, you just call me names.)  Then I might say, “ya know, I never thought of that way.”  What’s the result?  You have just changed my idea.  On the other hand, I may be able to logically and sensibly overcome your challenge.  Not to win or be right, but to weed through to the truth.  Now, if I can logically, not vindictively, overcome your challenge, then I reaffirm my idea.  And it’s not about the so called “right idea” being MY idea, but getting to the best idea by challenging, modifying, considering, combining, and rationalizing multiple ideas.  What I’m talking about is intellectual, civil, debate.  What better way to debate an issue, and only involve the issue, than on the internet.  Removing all notions of race, religion, sex, occupation, wealth, personal history, etc…  In other words, don’t debate like we see many politicians smear reputations of their opponents.  Stay focused on the issue which will then, most likely, lead to a solution to a problem.  

    So, I asked the question. “What could I do?”  Well, if you want to change the world, you must change ideas.  Not control, but through debate.  That means if you still don’t change ideas after we debate, then you’re a free thinker.  If you do change ideas after we debate, you’re still a free thinker.  See, you THOUGHT about it.  Well, ideas lead to action and action produces results.  This is not NSA mind control.  So, get off that high horse before you even get on it.

    I actually thought about running for office, not soon enough.  Maybe be a talk show host, still might take to long to get in a position.  Get on the internet, that’s easy, I’m on every day.  I could start blogging.  I knew that if I wanted to change people’s ideas, I couldn’t just get with a bunch of Rush fans and pat ourselves on the back saying, “yeah, those Democrats, those Republicans, they’re screwing it all up.”  Well, if anything is screwing it up, it’s the people and their IDEAS.  So, I figured the best thing to do would be to debate with people who disagree with me.  Yes, I am here to change your ideas, but before you start screaming “infiltrator, mind control, NSA”.  Let me tell you now.  I am open to debate, which means I am open to changing my ideas.  If you can convince me, then I’m convinced.  If you call me names, I’m probably not going to hear you.

    Oh, and about derailing your letter campaign or whatever you’re doing, how could I?  I don’t know where or you are and I’m not going to ask.  In fact, even if you change my ideas and I’d like to join your cause and you want me to join, let’s just agree now, never to divulge our personal identities.  Fair?  


    this also addresses your questions about concealing my identity to establish credibility.  Credibility is something I’ll have to establish and maintain over time.  The reason for anonymity is more for sincerity and honesty.  That doesn’t mean I’m right and might be misinformed.  I may honestly give you the wrong information.  I was hoping that it might demonstrate that I have no outside influence to gain or personal motives.  When people set out to change people’s minds, they can acquire followers.  That’s not what I want.  I want to enable free thinkers.    

    I don’t work for anybody.  Even if I was, you’re ignorant to use that as an excuse to avoid the debate.  Even if I was being paid to debate with you, if I can’t change your ideas, then I can’t change your ideas.  I don’t know who you are other than rusty1776 and I have no leverage or control over you.  I couldn’t manipulate or force you into anything.  

    Who are you to criticize me for concealing my identity?  Why don’t you give me your name and tell me where you sleep?  You’d be crazy to do so, right?  I don’t need to know and don’t want to know.  

    In response to your threat to reply to every post I make.  Well, I believe in free speech, so do as you must.  Although, I think your time could be better spent forwarding your own cause than trying to stop mine.  If you could stop the name calling and open a discussion with me, you might find that we agree on some things.  If you think I’m a fraud, prove it.  I’m sure you find this hard to believe, but no one is paying me to debate these issues.  

    Let me share something I’ve heard and don’t really believe, yet.  I heard someone say, “Liberals will not debate the issue with you.  They will either attack you or walk away from the discussion.”  Rusty, you’re the only person I’ve encountered so far that seems to fit that description.  I try to be careful about labeling people.  So, I’ll just say that, “Rusty, for whatever reason, doesn’t debate issues; he just gets mad and personally attacks you.” Oh, sticks and stones…

    Could someone define a few terms from your posts?








    Get the nose

    I know some of our discussions have hit on healthcare, but I have something else I just learned about that I think is more important than healthcare.  I’ll post on it later.  It’s 3:45 and need some sleep.  

  11. Here is something I am very concerned about and I think we all should be.  Despite this will make many on the left happy to see what could happen immediately, in the long term I think there is a more critical and foundational problem here.

    Your thoughts?

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