Civil Asset Forfeiture: Seize BP’s and Goldman’s computer networks.

(4PM EST – promoted by Nightprowlkitty)

From the description of the relevant laws, it ain’t that hard to do.

Asset forfeiture is a term used to describe the confiscation of assets, by the state, which are either (a) the proceeds of crime or (b) the instrumentalities of crime, and more recently, terrorism. Instrumentalities of crime are property that was used to facilitate crime, for example cars used to transport illegal narcotics. The terminology used in different jurisdictions varies. Some jurisdictions use the term “confiscation” instead of forfeiture. In recent years there has been a growing trend for countries to introduce civil forfeiture. Such proceedings may be brought in the USA, Australia, the UK, Ireland, Italy, South Africa, various Canadian Provinces and Antigua.

There are two types of forfeiture cases, criminal and civil. Almost all forfeiture cases today are civil.[citation needed] In civil forfeiture cases, the US Government sues the item of property, not the person; the owner is effectively a third party claimant. Before the Civil Asset Forfeiture Reform Act was enacted in 2000, the government only had to establish probable cause that the property was subject to forfeiture; the owner had to prove on a “preponderance of the evidence” that it was not. The new law holds the government to the “preponderance of evidence” standard and shifts the burden of proof to the federal government instead of the property owner.[1] The property owner still need not be found guilty of any crime. In contrast, criminal forfeiture is usually carried out in a sentence following a conviction and is a punitive act against the offender. Since the government can choose the type of case, a civil case is almost always chosen. The costs of such cases is high for the owner, usually totaling around $10,000 and can take up to three years.

The justification for doing so would be easy: We have, by now, massive evidence that crimes were committed, in the case of Goldman Sachs, outright fraud, in the case of BP, negligence.

A preponderance of the evidence that crimes were committed would be all that would be required; the purpose of the civil asset forfeiture law is to make it possible to enforce laws against organized crime.

I would argue that, in the methodology Goldman Sachs and similar banks have used to shield themselves from all accountability would be to all intents and purposes similar to the actions of organized crime: no one saw nothin’, no one “remembers” anything, and all the criminal fraud, negligence and malfeasance is contained in house and shielded by a misuse of the law – binding legal confidentiality agreements and conflict of interest waivers.

The law, make no mistake, is a bad law, in my opinion.  It has been used in the past to prosecute the ill conceived “war on drugs”, to take the property of perceived drug runners in violation of due process.

Why not use a bad law, though, to accomplish something to uphold the rule of law?

But this makes it even more of a good idea to use civil asset forfeiture to attack the assets of the criminal corporate enterprises.  Either the suits would be successful, in which, it’s a victory for the People, or the Goldman Sachs, BP, et. al, would win, in which case, a threat to due process under the Constitution would be removed.  IT WOULD STILL BE A VICTORY FOR THE PEOPLE.

It makes sense to use a wedge to both make life a living hell for the criminal enterprises operating in our country and also use any potential constitutional blowback to otherwise uphold the constitution and the rule of law.

Why seize their computer networks?

It is said that these types of cases, due to the complexity of the crimes committed, for the Federal Government to prosecute.  It takes years, and it is also possible during the time when evidence is being sought for the companies and individuals being investigated to have evidence destroyed.

But the argument then for civil asset forfeiture would be straightforward: Their computer networks are instrumentalities of crime and therefore prime candidates for seizing of property under this law, and, in addition, a successful forfeiture would make the computer networks, servers, and connected equipment the property of the Federal government, and therefore, to destroy evidence would be tampering with Federal Property.

It may be that it would also be necessary to obtain warrants to search these computer networks for evidence of criminal wrongdoing even after they’ve been seized.  But, this would be fine.  First seize the computer networks of these companies — perhaps even permit the companies in question to continue using them under a leaseback agreement, under strict federal supervision (since they would then be the property of the federal government) to run day to day operations, and during this period, obtain the appropriate warrants.

It would be simpler to obtain criminal accountability when one has control of the computer networks of the suspected criminal enterprises and therefore makes them go the extra mile into the realm of a very simple crime if they attempted to destroy evidence.

The whole reason civil asset forfeiture exists is to make it simpler and easier for the Federal Government to act against criminal enterprises that are operating outside the scope of the laws.

To commit fraud is a crime, last time I checked.  To operate with reckless disregard for the consequences of one’s decisions is negligence, also a crime.  If all that is required is a preponderance of evidence that such fraud and negligence occurred, it may be finally time to use the power of the law against more than penny ante drug runners.

To say it’s almost impossible, due to the complexity of crimes committed, to hold these large multinational corporations to account, I believe, is a way of copping out.

It’s time to use every legal mechanism, whereby even the constitution has long been eroded to make small criminals and organized crime harder to get away with.  And, in a way that you cannot lose — if the law is deemed unconstitutional in order to protect these large corporations, it would still have the salutary effect of striking down at least one threat to Constitutional government in the first place.

When you have a way of acting in which the People cannot lose, it would be foolish not to take advantage of it.


Obviously, I’m not a lawyer, it would seem to me to be obvious the civil asset forfeiture laws that do exist could be applied this way — but it’s an interesting question to ask.


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  1. the law.

  2. I said it when the banks ‘failed’. Seize their assets and their CEO’s assets and no bail out would be necessary. This applies more so to BP, because the ways this will play out they will go into bankruptcy and we the people will pay for the mess they leave behind. That includes the people who’s livelihood was destroyed by BP’s greed and negligence.

    And another thought: Does anyone really believe O when he says

    “…BP will pay for this..” We know his words are just that..words! Usually they mean the opposite.

  3. too much sense to actually get done.

    of course we are intransigent as a country.

    i doubt anything will change before it is too late.

    isn’t it too late for the gulf coast already?

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