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Americans Sold Out Again! Thanks, Congress! (Update!)

by: tahoebasha3

Sun Nov 08, 2009 at 07:41:01 PST        
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(See Update below:)

So much for progressives who promised they would vote "NO" if there was no robust public option.  Only Kucinich and Massa stood by their words.

This, from Dennis Kucinich, on the passing of the healthcare bill by Congress:

Who Said They'd Vote No on a Healthcare Bill This Bad in July, And Who Lied.  By David Swanson.

These 57 (PDF) said they would not accept a bill this bad. These two kept their word: Kucinich, Massa. The other 55 lied. Kucinich's statement below the fold.

Kucinich: Why I Voted NO

Washington D.C. (November 7, 2009) - After voting against H.R. 3962 - Affordable Health Care for America Act, Congressman Dennis Kucinich (D-OH) today made the following statement:

"We have been led to believe that we must make our health care choices only within the current structure of a predatory, for-profit insurance system which makes money not providing health care. We cannot fault the insurance companies for being what they are. But we can fault legislation in which the government incentivizes the perpetuation, indeed the strengthening, of the for-profit health insurance industry, the very source of the problem. When health insurance companies deny care or raise premiums, co-pays and deductibles they are simply trying to make a profit. That is our system.

"Clearly, the insurance companies are the problem, not the solution. They are driving up the cost of health care. Because their massive bureaucracy avoids paying bills so effectively, they force hospitals and doctors to hire their own bureaucracy to fight the insurance companies to avoid getting stuck with an unfair share of the bills. The result is that since 1970, the number of physicians has increased by less than 200% while the number of administrators has increased by 3000%. It is no wonder that 31 cents of every health care dollar goes to administrative costs, not toward providing care. Even those with insurance are at risk. The single biggest cause of bankruptcies in the U.S. is health insurance policies that do not cover you when you get sick.

"But instead of working toward the elimination of for-profit insurance, H.R. 3962 would put the government in the role of accelerating the privatization of health care. In H.R. 3962, the government is requiring at least 21 million Americans to buy private health insurance from the very industry that causes costs to be so high, which will result in at least $70 billion in new annual revenue, much of which is coming from taxpayers. This inevitably will lead to even more costs, more subsidies, and higher profits for insurance companies - a bailout under a blue cross.

"By incurring only a new requirement to cover pre-existing conditions, a weakened public option, and a few other important but limited concessions, the health insurance companies are getting quite a deal. The Center for American Progress' blog, Think Progress, states "since the President signaled that he is backing away from the public option, health insurance stocks have been on the rise." Similarly, healthcare stocks rallied when Senator Max Baucus introduced a bill without a public option. Bloomberg reports that Curtis Lane, a prominent health industry investor, predicted a few weeks ago that "money will start flowing in again" to health insurance stocks after passage of the legislation. Investors.com last month reported that pharmacy benefit managers share prices are hitting all-time highs, with the only industry worry that the Administration would reverse its decision not to negotiate Medicare Part D drug prices, leaving in place a Bush Administration policy.

"During the debate, when the interests of insurance companies would have been effectively challenged, that challenge was turned back. The "robust public option" which would have offered a modicum of competition to a monopolistic industry was whittled down from an initial potential enrollment of 129 million Americans to 6 million. An amendment which would have protected the rights of states to pursue single-payer health care was stripped from the bill at the request of the Administration. Looking ahead, we cringe at the prospect of even greater favors for insurance companies.

"Recent rises in unemployment indicate a widening separation between the finance economy and the real economy. The finance economy considers the health of Wall Street, rising corporate profits, and banks' hoarding of cash, much of it from taxpayers, as sign of an economic recovery. However in the real economy -- in which most Americans live -- the recession is not over. Rising unemployment, business failures, bankruptcies and foreclosures are still hammering Main Street.

"This health care bill continues the redistribution of wealth to Wall Street at the expense of America's manufacturing and service economies which suffer from costs other countries do not have to bear, especially the cost of health care. America continues to stand out among all industrialized nations for its privatized health care system. As a result, we are less competitive in steel, automotive, aerospace and shipping while other countries subsidize their exports in these areas through socializing the cost of health care.

"Notwithstanding the fate of H.R. 3962, America will someday come to recognize the broad social and economic benefits of a not-for-profit, single-payer health care system, which is good for the American people and good for America's businesses, with of course the notable exceptions being insurance and pharmaceuticals."

Well, at least we have a list of all the progressives that didn't stand the test -- think they and all the other Dems need to hear from us BIG TIME!!!!!!!

BTW, already the health care insurance industry stocks have gone up!!!!!

Update With the Latest News:  Well, the "shine" has already been rubbed off of the "new penny."  I don't think this will surprise many, but -- see the rest here.

tahoebasha3 :: Americans Sold Out Again! Thanks, Congress! (Update!)
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So GD disgusting! (4.00 / 29)
We DO need to get rid of these self-serving critters -- BIG TIME!

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE

Anti-Kucinich Diary On Rec List @ Orange (4.00 / 19)
....typical 'hopey-change' folks trashing courageous Dem.

Authoritarian political ideologies have a vested interest in promoting fear. ----Susan Sontag

[ Parent ]
How many of them (4.00 / 14)
work for insurance companies?

[ Parent ]
How many are kids living in (4.00 / 11)
their parents' basements?  Obama wanted this bill.  The progressives had bargaining power, and they all gave in again, even with anti-abortion language in it.  Well in Massa, at least Dennis isn't alone anymore.  Next election, I'm voting for him even if I have to write him in.  Screw them.

(Thanks all for covering my back while I was over there.)  


[ Parent ]
Probably most of them just don't know any better... (4.00 / 5)
...which seems to be much of the story over there. I like the place, but their cheerleading and fanclubbery is very annoying.

[ Parent ]
If you get on the wrong side (4.00 / 6)
of one of the little clubs, be prepared to be stalked and harassed until either you leave or they trap you in their little web and get you banned. I find it best to ignore them or humor them.

"By the pricking of my thumb, something wicked this way comes.", Wm. Shakespeare, "Macbeth"

[ Parent ]
I find it best (4.00 / 5)
to mock them.  They can't get you banned for agreeing with them by restating their case in ever more ridiculous terms.  At least not yet ;).  


i love the smell of bipartisanship in the morning...
smells like...fucktory. -bubanomics


[ Parent ]
what a bunch of pathetic idiots (4.00 / 16)
They're pisssed on, told it's raining, and they're celebrating.

There's a word for that:   fools.



"Never let a serious crisis go to waste. What I mean by that is it's an opportunity to do things you couldn't do before." -- Rahm Emanuel


[ Parent ]
make it stop! (4.00 / 11)
Fuck You Very Much.

okay Im turning on pandora and cleaning house. thats it for me today.  

No justice, no peace.


[ Parent ]
OMG, OMG, OMG.... (4.00 / 9)
I dropped a link to here.  

[ Parent ]
I posted a thank you comment (4.00 / 8)
there, too.

[ Parent ]
We are all such instigators. ;-) (4.00 / 11)


"By the pricking of my thumb, something wicked this way comes.", Wm. Shakespeare, "Macbeth"

[ Parent ]
What's really strange (4.00 / 7)
is that he's only got 11 comments.

Where are the rest of the cheering squad?


[ Parent ]
exhausred themselves? (4.00 / 10)
or still too busy bashing anyone who criticizes this bill or Obama

"By the pricking of my thumb, something wicked this way comes.", Wm. Shakespeare, "Macbeth"

[ Parent ]
Maybe they're not sure (4.00 / 5)
if he's being sarcastic or not.

[ Parent ]
The last comment title (from the diarist): (4.00 / 4)
No, I'm not kidding.

bwa ha ha ha ha ha

All that campaign cash buys a lot of stupid.


[ Parent ]
Pretty amazing, isn't it? (4.00 / 4)
;-)

[ Parent ]
If that's the best... (4.00 / 7)
that diary can do on dKos, the Dems are in serious trouble right now.

And as well they should be.

All that campaign cash buys a lot of stupid.


[ Parent ]
I guess most there are just (4.00 / 4)
hypercritical of anybody criticizing how supportive they are of each other. Or something...

[ Parent ]
heh (4.00 / 5)
no enemies targets in range... no need.

No justice, no peace.

[ Parent ]
I wonder (4.00 / 3)
should I thank Michele Bachmann for voting against it?  


i love the smell of bipartisanship in the morning...
smells like...fucktory. -bubanomics


[ Parent ]
I was wonderng the same (4.00 / 3)
about my blue dog rep who said days ago and proudly announced on the FP of our local freeper rag that he would vote against the bill. I think he did the right thing but for the wrong reasons.

"By the pricking of my thumb, something wicked this way comes.", Wm. Shakespeare, "Macbeth"

[ Parent ]
With enemies like that (4.00 / 2)
who needs friends?  


i love the smell of bipartisanship in the morning...
smells like...fucktory. -bubanomics


[ Parent ]
LOL (4.00 / 5)
You are so bad. The OKDNW crew lurks here any way.

"By the pricking of my thumb, something wicked this way comes.", Wm. Shakespeare, "Macbeth"

[ Parent ]
When you read this diary, (4.00 / 7)
how can anyone not get it?   Can they all really be that stupid?  Never mind, you don't need to answer that.  

[ Parent ]
thanks for the post (4.00 / 11)
During the election, on Orange, I made a point that progressives should huddle around Kucinich though we all know he had no chance to personally win. But making him our standard bearer would have given us (not him) a victory. We would have become a force within the Democratic Party. The reason we did not is that nearly all on the left wanted to back whoever would have been the eventual winner. This, in my view, shows up the agonizing idiocy of the left in this country. It's as if we are asking second graders to do calculus. Most people across the left spectrum simply DO NOT UNDERSTAND that politics is the application of power. You cannot make bargains without having power. You can't say to Obama -- hey man, it would be really the right thing to do a, b and c. He would laugh at you, in private of course. He would point out that he already knows that single payer is the only rational choice but he would ask you "how many divisions do you control?" He would go on to say that the insurance companies have the fucking WH surrounded with tanks.

You get my drift. If we had supported K we would have put him, that rarest of animals an honest pol, in a powerful bargaining position. He would have been a spokesman and the media would have had to at least give him some room. They would have savagely attacked him, of course, but that would have threatened to expose, to the left at least, the fangs and agenda of the MSM, many of whom believe the NYT is a "liberal" or left leaning organization.  

Visit me at Sacred Bells


Well, the underlying assumption of your post (4.00 / 5)
is that someone besides Kucinich in the Democratic Party actually CARED about delivering health care to the American people and kicking the insurance companies to the curb.

:)

And most people who call themselves "Democrats" (I like to use the word "Dumbocrats" at this point, although it doesn't go over too well since the right wing thought of it first) is that they follow that party.

And that party deliberately does not represent them, but instead is a sham.

Thus .... only pretty smart people figure this out.

Not that many people are smart enough, or maybe old enough, or both, to see what's really going on.

"Go team!   Rah Rah Rah!   That's MY team!"

It's about as much sense as idolizing a multi-million-dollar star sports figure, wearing his jersey, and thinking that somewhere, somehow, he actually CARES about you, simply because you idolize him.   It's the same psychology.    The Democrats don't know their constituents exist, any more than Terrel Owens knows his "fans" exist.  



"Never let a serious crisis go to waste. What I mean by that is it's an opportunity to do things you couldn't do before." -- Rahm Emanuel


[ Parent ]
they would if.. (4.00 / 5)
... people sent money to Kucinich instead of DNC and other mainstream Dems. I'm sure you don't, but we should encourage others to not give to the Dems and only to Kucinich and others who are on the level.

Visit me at Sacred Bells

[ Parent ]
I, for one, sent money to Kucinich many times in the past and (4.00 / 2)
I backed him every way I could -- of course, he wouldn't get the presidency -- no BIG CORPORATE FUNDING, but I wanted him to remain as one, Wexler has since moved on, of the most important voices we've got in our government period.  And, he doesn't give up and is consistent at all times.

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE

[ Parent ]
I think it's worse than that (4.00 / 2)
I don't think "we" have enough money in the world to tilt the power away from those with the real power.

But that's just me.

Those with the real power deal with more than just money, they deal with threats and blackmail as well.

REAL power.  :)

"Never let a serious crisis go to waste. What I mean by that is it's an opportunity to do things you couldn't do before." -- Rahm Emanuel


[ Parent ]
if we focused it (4.00 / 2)
we would have some power. We would need to take other steps but it would be a start. The ones with real power will give it up if you make a good effort to snatch it away. The power scene is fairly fluid and one can play one faction against the other. Some in the Wall Street crowd, for example, aren't happy with sleeping with the Texas crowd and their Neocon allies -- it's a rather tense alliance.

If you can't focus your power behind somebody like Kucinich who actually represents what we believe then the powerful will just smirk. Those people actually admire a little fight and a little spunk. "We" aren't going to take over but we can be in the political game rather than passive players.  

Visit me at Sacred Bells


[ Parent ]
I'm not really disagreeing (4.00 / 3)
Kucinich deserves all the support we can possibly give him.

But will it have any affect?

Sadly, I think not.



"Never let a serious crisis go to waste. What I mean by that is it's an opportunity to do things you couldn't do before." -- Rahm Emanuel


[ Parent ]
It can't have any less... (4.00 / 4)
...affect than we have now.  So...?  What's to lose by trying?

The fierce urgency of now.  Martin

[ Parent ]
So, what's to lose? (4.00 / 3)
Nothing -- we NEED Kucinich's voice and standing behind him in every way that we can should make a loud statement to others!

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE

[ Parent ]
Yes - Yes - Yes ... (4.00 / 3)
...Go Dennis!!!

The fierce urgency of now.  Martin

[ Parent ]
my guess (4.00 / 2)
is that it will give leftists a place to congregate. Maybe have a few parties and get-togethers have a good time etc.  

Visit me at Sacred Bells

[ Parent ]
banger assumes that. (4.00 / 4)
The point is that we have no power, not one freakin bit.  IF we finally band together against the Democratic establishment, we stand a slim chance of gaining some power.   Since Dennis (and Dean) are the only ones with guts enough to take them on, we abandon our own ideals and our only hope if we abandon them.  

[ Parent ]
New Party (4.00 / 4)
is really the only hope.

It may take years, but it's the only hope.

Really.



"Never let a serious crisis go to waste. What I mean by that is it's an opportunity to do things you couldn't do before." -- Rahm Emanuel


[ Parent ]
Banding behind Dennis (or a Howard Dean) (4.00 / 6)
is the only instant third party we've got.   Tell you this much Inky, every day I walk further and further away.  As a good friend always said to me, "why do you vote?  It only encourages them.)   I'm done being used.  

[ Parent ]
you gotta vote! just ... vote for yourself! (4.00 / 2)
and how is that a wasted vote?

I get to vote for Jim McDermott, WA-7, and like the rest of the diaper shitter Progressives WHAT does he accomplish cuz they won't Stupak anyone, anytime, anywhere?

So, I write my own name in - or my aunt's - or a Seattle Mariner bench warmer

I'd love to see an election where the go-fuck-yourselves got more votes than the candidates.

rmm.


[ Parent ]
I don't know if a NEW party is what we need -- I kinda' think we'd (4.00 / 6)
be better off with NO PARTIES at all -- have run off voting, such as in some other countries.  A two-party system is far from democratic -- what a choice of one of two candidates?  And a third party has always, always failed!  

Our whole system, including financial support for candidates, etc., etc., needs to be completely revamped to get rid of the "criminal" and fraudulent methods of electing our president and our representatives.  You have to get rid of the financial inequity that exists -- so it would mean a limited dollar amount across the board, etc.

Or, maybe, WE the PEOPLE should just go off quietly and form our own government and f..k 'em all!  LOL!


Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE


[ Parent ]
I like that (4.00 / 5)

Or, maybe, WE the PEOPLE should just go off quietly and form our own government and f..k 'em all!  LOL!

Actually, we have the Constitutional right to do exactly that.

Most people don't realize it.  

The founding fathers had provisions built in, for times exactly like these.



"Never let a serious crisis go to waste. What I mean by that is it's an opportunity to do things you couldn't do before." -- Rahm Emanuel


[ Parent ]
Actually IRV is the silver bullet. (4.00 / 6)
The Left and the Right (teabaggers and commies ;-) should work together on IRV.

IRV allows us to slide people in to office at best and allows values to be clearly communicated to the finger in the wind candidates that need some voter mojo.

IRV is the silver bullet. It changes everything.


[ Parent ]
Interesting idea. (4.00 / 4)


All that campaign cash buys a lot of stupid.

[ Parent ]
Interesting idea. (0.00 / 0)


All that campaign cash buys a lot of stupid.

[ Parent ]
we just got it passed (4.00 / 1)
in Mpls.  Now if we can only get it on the state ballot. We already have three parties, and people Pawlenty and even Bachmann benefit from it.  Pawlenty hasn't gotten 50% in even one election.  

Our third party works like a spoiler party, giving moderate repubs a choice when there is an idiot like Bachmann running, with the one exception of Jesse V getting elected.  With IRV, people could vote their conscience, and the third party may have some sway after the election rather than just before it.  If we already had IRV, we wouldn't have had to wait months for Al Franken to take office.  It's long past time, at least where I live, for IRV.  


i love the smell of bipartisanship in the morning...
smells like...fucktory. -bubanomics


[ Parent ]
Yeah well (4.00 / 2)
when Weiner started mocking Alan Grayson, and dropped his single payer vote, it was over.  There will not be health care reform in any positive way for consumers.  Once this shit hits the fan, dems will be out in the woods again wondering how they got there.  


i love the smell of bipartisanship in the morning...
smells like...fucktory. -bubanomics


[ Parent ]
Banger...I like (4.00 / 2)
...your ideas and reasoning here.

The fierce urgency of now.  Martin

[ Parent ]
Of course Banger (4.00 / 2)
this was what my "Do Progressives Want Power?" diary was about

"Mientras el trabajo sea una comodidad, un mecanismo de extracción de plusvalía y un arma de alienación, el sistema y sus miserias sobrevivirán."  -Peter McLaren

[ Parent ]
I know and (4.00 / 2)
I hope you continue in that vein.

Visit me at Sacred Bells

[ Parent ]
Who's that in the yellow? (4.00 / 2)
her personal hairdresser?  

Just curious, it seriously looks like her stylist or something.

"Never let a serious crisis go to waste. What I mean by that is it's an opportunity to do things you couldn't do before." -- Rahm Emanuel


[ Parent ]
That's DeLauro from CT. Not sure of her (4.00 / 1)
title these days.

Learn to love.

[ Parent ]
Just received!!! (4.00 / 2)
I don't know how many of you have received this, but probably many of you have or will receive it!


B. E. --

Last night, your representative, Rep. Jesse Jackson, cast a courageous vote to help pass comprehensive health reform. After months of debate and decades of false starts, this was the biggest step yet on the path to making real health insurance reform a reality.

But before health reform can become law, it must pass one more time through the House of Representatives. The insurance companies will be throwing everything they can at changing Rep. Jackson's vote for the final round, so it's crucial that we publicly show that the voters in your district support reform and are counting on Rep. Jackson to stand firm.

One of the best ways to help is to write a letter to the editor of a local newspaper thanking Rep. Jackson for supporting health reform.

Can you write one today?

You don't have to be an expert to write a very powerful letter. We'll provide helpful information about the House bill and health reform. But the best content comes from you.

You can tell your personal story about why health reform matters to you, your family, and your community. You can write about how important it is that our representatives stand with their constituents and not the special interests -- as Rep. Jackson did last night. What matters the most is that you write from the heart and speak out as a concerned citizen at this crucial time.

With reform's passage out of the House, there are three major steps left, and it's going to be a fight the whole way: the Senate will soon vote on their version of bill, then there will be a last round of negotiations to combine them, and then a final vote in both the House and Senate.

Your words could mean all the difference as we take the next steps toward passing reform this year.

Get started here:

http://my.barackobama.com/HouseVoteLTE

Thank you,

Mitch

Mitch Stewart
Director
Organizing for America

Can I write a letter "thanking?" my Representative?  You bet -- no problem!!!!  Thanks for the friggin' invitation!  I might cc:  Mitch Stewart, while I'm at it!!!
 

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE


CCing Mitch Stewart... (4.00 / 1)
...doesn't work any more.  They've established a reply daemon gatekeeper to bar the rabble from entry.

The fierce urgency of now.  Martin

[ Parent ]
Thanks for posting Dennis'... (4.00 / 2)
...letter.  When I read it this morning, I thought I'd post it, but then got to dd and saw you already had done so.  Good!  

The fierce urgency of now.  Martin

[ Parent ]
My Comment Could Use A Rec (4.00 / 3)
...I thought it was pretty good, and it has zero at last look.  Must not be respectful enuf or sumpin'.
http://www.dailykos.com/commen...

Authoritarian political ideologies have a vested interest in promoting fear. ----Susan Sontag

Thanks... (4.00 / 4)
I actually thought it might get HR'd.

Authoritarian political ideologies have a vested interest in promoting fear. ----Susan Sontag

[ Parent ]
On my way! (4.00 / 5)


The fierce urgency of now.  Martin

[ Parent ]
A good piece at HuffPo (4.00 / 6)
Kucinich's Brave Health Vote Vs. Obama's Failed Promise



"Never let a serious crisis go to waste. What I mean by that is it's an opportunity to do things you couldn't do before." -- Rahm Emanuel


Great quote from HuffPo... (4.00 / 9)
...article Inky links:

Progressives should be every bit as upset that President Obama lied to us to get his historic health bill. The citizens of this country did not have a seat at the table. Proponents of the Single Payer didn't have a seat at the table. Under the guise of health care reform, we watched as the insurance industry got a bill passed that entrenches and enriches them.



The fierce urgency of now.  Martin


[ Parent ]
Thanks for that link, Inky99! (4.00 / 3)
Just what we've been discussing above:

If enough of us stand with Dennis Kucinich, maybe we'll actually get real health care reform. If we don't, maybe we don't deserve that reform.

Read more at Inky's link:  Kucinich's Brave . . . .

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE


[ Parent ]
His promise though is only as good (4.00 / 1)
as the people's who job it was to craft the bill.  He strikes me as one who wanted to go for the gold, but was tempered by bought souls.

Learn to love.

[ Parent ]
Obama's Failed Promise? Which failed promise? So far, so many failed (4.00 / 1)
promises, so little Change. What do you suppose the next big cynical slogan will be?  

[ Parent ]
Did I know it was going to suck? (4.00 / 5)
Well yes I did.
Did I tell anyone I knew it was going to suck?
Ya, I told lots of people it was going to suck.
How did you know?
I live in mAssashcusetts, the pilot/model for this piece of shit state.
Did you have any other sources?
Well yeah, the Bilderberg group said two evil memes this year.  Globalization of all the money and two globalization of everything health.  That was in May.
Does it suck?
Yes it does.

Whatever you do to others you also do to yourself!

I am such a suporter of Kucinich's (4.00 / 7)
ideas.  He is a noble man in my estimation.

Learn to love.

Yes, indeed, (4.00 / 7)
he is a principled man with great integrity!  Couldn't agree more!

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE

[ Parent ]
I am such a suporter of Kucinich's (4.00 / 2)
ideas.  He is a noble man in my estimation.

Learn to love.

Well, the "shine" has already been rubbed off of the "new penny." (4.00 / 5)
I don't think this will surprise many, but

"The House bill is dead on arrival in the Senate," Sen. Lindsey Graham, R-S.C., said dismissively.

Democrats did not line up to challenge him. Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., has yet to schedule floor debate and hinted last week that senators may not be able to finish health care this year.

O.K., so this terrible health care bill does not stand a chance in the Senate?  So, hypothetically, if it were even a half-way decent bill -- that, too, would stand even less of a chance, obviously!  So, why don't we just call our representatives and tell them to take their tiddly winks on home and forget the mention of a health care plan for Americans? Amazing how quickly we got the poor (the sky's gonna' cave in) Wall Street babies their goodies, isn't it?  

Watch the health care insurance company PUSH REAL HARD now -- just watch  -- now that they have Congress on their side!

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE


And, maybe, some of you have thought of this or not! (4.00 / 3)
While most of us were in the midst of talking about "war crimes," torture, etc. heretofore, has this "circus" about health care reform NOT served as a tremendous diversion to OUR call for ACCOUNTABILITY?  

While we, Americans, have struggles just to keep it all going, these "fockers" in our government can sit there and cajole, ponder and fabricate, whilst we all struggle, and THEY don't give a damn (our tax-paying dollars be damned).  Just watch C-Span sometime, as our illustrious representatives speak on behalf of, hummmm, not quite sure WHO -- themselves, and their wanton and self-serving ways, at our expense, or, maybe, SHOULD WE give a little to the people?  



Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE


[ Parent ]
But but but (4.00 / 2)
keep your powder dry!  Else we won't get health care we can believe in!  


i love the smell of bipartisanship in the morning...
smells like...fucktory. -bubanomics


[ Parent ]
That's the important thing (4.00 / 4)
Keep on believin'...

"success is a journey, not a destination", or something... ;-)


[ Parent ]
We can only hope that we're that lucky.... n.t (4.00 / 1)


[ Parent ]
Speaking of Kucinich just a little above -- (4.00 / 7)
it would be so COOOOL if there was a way to send a "thank-you" to Kucinich and Massa, for their stand.

I don't quite know how to set that up, though!

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE


I think you just did, no? (4.00 / 2)


[ Parent ]
Thanks, was in a super hurry! (4.00 / 1)
I meant as a "collective" effort, so that somehow we could all sign a letter of gratitude and foward it on!  I know it can be done, I just don't know how to do it!

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE

[ Parent ]
Dennis Kucinich and Eric Massa (4.00 / 5)

Kucinich (202) 225-5871

Massa (202) 225-3161

"Mientras el trabajo sea una comodidad, un mecanismo de extracción de plusvalía y un arma de alienación, el sistema y sus miserias sobrevivirán."  -Peter McLaren


[ Parent ]
Thank you, cassiodorus! (4.00 / 3)
Thank you for supplying the telephone numbers.  Honestly speaking, I have them.  I was thinking more in terms of a "collective" effort on the part of ALL of us to show our support of Kucinich and Massa.  I think that would be sooo great -- in the face of it all.  Unfortunately, as I've said, I just don't know how to set it up.  I could do a letter -- but how do we get ALL of our signatures on it?  I know it can be done!  David Swanson, has done it numerous times.  

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE

[ Parent ]
Dennis will be on Democracy NOW tomorrow? (4.00 / 2)
rumor. but Im not sure how to verify.

No justice, no peace.

[ Parent ]
linky goodness here (4.00 / 3)
D NOW! w Kucinich on HCR it says Jame Hamsher also. Ill go listen in a bit.

No justice, no peace.

[ Parent ]
Thanks for the reminder, LL (4.00 / 3)


"By the pricking of my thumb, something wicked this way comes.", Wm. Shakespeare, "Macbeth"

[ Parent ]
Kucinich is going to be on the Ed Schultz show today, as well! (4.00 / 2)
[ Parent ]
Don't worry, someone will soon be here (4.00 / 3)
to tell us it's all the Republicans fault.  And I know who that will be.

You have just blown my mind, wilberforce! (4.00 / 1)
Please explain yourself, please!

Eight years and plus of the Bush Administration and policies have put this country in an "abyss" from which we MUST find a way to extricate ourselves.  So far, it's not going too well -- in other words, same as usual!  


Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE


[ Parent ]
Alan Grayson???? (4.00 / 2)
Underdog, why do you say this?  Grayson has been a very STRONG voice in support of health care for EVERYONE!

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE

[ Parent ]
Oh I know tb3. I was being a bit snarkish, sorry. I like his style (4.00 / 4)
but his emphasis on republicans just misses the mark when I believe the problem is corporatism across both parties.  So Grayson can blame the repubs all he wants, but it aint gonna change the money factor.  

[ Parent ]
I know. Maybe it's time for some more down home town halls? (4.00 / 2)
Let's let the hoi polloi smash each other on the heads again and the media take serious note. This will fill in some good time while "waiting for the real stuff to happen". It's all just logical, natural evolution of legislation; from health reform to insurance reform to laws making people buy insurance to women's reproductive choice limitations so people can actually get the law that makes them buy insurance to get to (finally) a great self congratulatory orgy.  

Give your input over at FDL: (4.00 / 4)
http://fdlaction.firedoglake.c...

"Mientras el trabajo sea una comodidad, un mecanismo de extracción de plusvalía y un arma de alienación, el sistema y sus miserias sobrevivirán."  -Peter McLaren

Thanks for that, cassiodorus! (4.00 / 2)
I'll take care of that a little later (I'm not logged in over there, I don't think).

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE

[ Parent ]
I like Jane Hamsher. (4.00 / 4)
She's not confused about issues of power like most progressives are.

"Mientras el trabajo sea una comodidad, un mecanismo de extracción de plusvalía y un arma de alienación, el sistema y sus miserias sobrevivirán."  -Peter McLaren

[ Parent ]
Seriously tahoebasha go over there... (4.00 / 5)
http://fdlaction.firedoglake.c...

Jane is trying to explain her strategy.  She needs to be pressed on this issue of where we should expend our energies.  If the public option that is in the Pelosi bill is unimportant, and the bill as a whole is only likely to get worse with Senate negotiations, why spend a lot of time on the Senate?  Wouldn't it be better just to put efforts into getting rid of the Blue Dogs?

"Mientras el trabajo sea una comodidad, un mecanismo de extracción de plusvalía y un arma de alienación, el sistema y sus miserias sobrevivirán."  -Peter McLaren


[ Parent ]
Thank you, I will in a bit. (4.00 / 3)
There's no question, I don't think, that the bill will be further watered down with no public option to speak of in the Senate.  There is barely one in the House bill.

I think we should expend our energies by calling the House, Senate Committees on Health, etc. and tell them to "kill the bill."  I'm frightened for Americans getting stuck with a mandate and shit for insurance.

We should KEEP SCREAMING for single-payer -- the only REAL and sensible kind of bill to have across the board.  But, you know, the already filthy rich insurance people have been throwing fits (with money) right down the line -- what lose all that obscene profit they've enjoyed for 75 years?

I'm sure Kucinich and Bernie Sanders know where we should expend our energies!

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE


[ Parent ]
. . . . . (4.00 / 3)
(Sorry, I've had little time today, just popping in and out on occasion.)  Thanks for the input, too, I should also have said.

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE

[ Parent ]
Also -- (4.00 / 4)
see this:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/...

"Mientras el trabajo sea una comodidad, un mecanismo de extracción de plusvalía y un arma de alienación, el sistema y sus miserias sobrevivirán."  -Peter McLaren


[ Parent ]
There are a lot of doctors (4.00 / 4)
who get it, this one included.

"By the pricking of my thumb, something wicked this way comes.", Wm. Shakespeare, "Macbeth"

[ Parent ]
Why am I not surprised? (4.00 / 2)
I was thinking outside of "DD," TMC!  No slight intended -- I believe, in fact, that I rather assumed you were one of those "who get it."  :)

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE

[ Parent ]
My other half gets it, too (4.00 / 2)
and he isn't registered on anybodies political web site

"By the pricking of my thumb, something wicked this way comes.", Wm. Shakespeare, "Macbeth"

[ Parent ]
cassiodorus, FYI! (4.00 / 2)
Went to FDL, posted a comment (on a very long thread -- glanced through some of the comments -- ugh!).  You will note my comment at #368.  

I usually like much of her thinking, but you will note, I do not on this particular issue!

(Is it just me, or is there some kind of a delayed reaction in posted there?  Took forever.  Just sayin'!)

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE


[ Parent ]
There's a pitfall there -- (4.00 / 4)
Jane Hamsher is not saying that the bill is better than nothing.  Jane Hamsher is saying that a bill with a public option is better than a bill with no public option.  She thinks that killing the bill is too daunting a task at present  (I am actually euphemizing -- she thinks it's "unrealistic") to achieve with much chance of success.  She may be right in arguing so.  

The Democrats in Congress are being pushed by Obama to get something, anything, passed.  So it will be worse than nothing.  The whole drive is being pushed through with a spirit of rabid conformism and abject failure to pay attention to what-all is exactly being voted upon.  Thus the Stupak Amendment.

If we are absolutely going to have a bill, I would argue, we need one with a small mandate penalty.  At this point I couldn't care less about the rest.

There is a piece she wrote somewhere on FDL, as well, saying that she wouldn't mind if Harry Reid took until after Xmas to get a bill passed.  The longer this thing is drawn out, I guess, the higher the chance that Congress will pay attention to what it is doing, and thus "kill the bill" may get an incrementally larger chance of looking like a real possibility.

My position on the whole matter is given in this diary, in comment #27.  We already know from the House experience where the progressive Democrats will draw the line.  Is there really any more point in lobbying Congress on this matter, without any further power to say "no" to the whole thing?  We should btw thank Bart Stupak for showing us that the one way that anyone in Congress will get anything done with this bill will be to hold it hostage.

"Mientras el trabajo sea una comodidad, un mecanismo de extracción de plusvalía y un arma de alienación, el sistema y sus miserias sobrevivirán."  -Peter McLaren


[ Parent ]
Thank you, cassiodorus! (4.00 / 4)
Went there and noted your comment (but I feel I'm going to need to re-read it in the a.m.).  Gettin' weary!

Yes, I understood:

Jane Hamsher is saying that a bill with a public option is better than a bill with no public option.

I still don't agree, though!

The REAL problem is that the idea and notion of a "single-payer" platform was killed from the get-go -- excluded the possibility.  This is where we were ALL duped, leaving us to believe that ALL we had left was a "public option."  We should have, instead, been shooting for the moon -- single-payer.  In that instance and had we done that, we may have gotten, in turn, a half-way tolerable "public option."  Instead, the whole health care issue has now been one of kinda' an auction (how much will you give me for this [terrible] car?)

Sorry, I just cannot conceive of "something is better than nothing" philosophy, no matter how it is "veiled."

I'm going to say it again, that we, Americans, should let our representatives know on NO uncertain terms, that we prefer to KILL THE BILL!  Let them put that in their pipes and digest it!!!!!!!

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE


[ Parent ]
Sure, kill the bill. (4.00 / 4)
I would agree with you.  Hamsher would agree with you.  The question is one of whether or not the bill can actually be killed.  We can tell from the experience with Kucinich and Massa that all who vote "no" will be viewed by Democrats as traitors.  The Democrats can count on more than half of the votes in both the Senate and the House, and upon Obama's signature.  Tell Congress "kill the bill" all you want.  Will it do any good?  Can you rustle up the resources to make it so?

At some point, tahoebasha3, you've got to imagine an outcome in which this bill passes.  Nobody will care at that point if we stomp our feet and hold our breaths until our faces turn blue.  We will have to do something proactive with such an outcome.  

If Hamsher is wasting her time, she's doing it by trying to figure out ways in which the Pelosi bill's "public option" can be expanded when it is activated in 2013.  I think our time is best spent predicting with pinpoint precision exactly what will happen with this bill, and using those predictions to sway the electorate, and thus to rearrange Congress in forthcoming elections.  And if that's not possible, we need to go to organizing for deeper-level changes in our political culture (in the vein explored by the Zapatistas).  Because nearly anything would be better than this.




"Mientras el trabajo sea una comodidad, un mecanismo de extracción de plusvalía y un arma de alienación, el sistema y sus miserias sobrevivirán."  -Peter McLaren


[ Parent ]
Thank you, cassidorus, for a very considered response. (4.00 / 4)
Quite weary with it all, at this point.  

I agree with most of what you said, but I really think we SHOULD GET ON THE PHONE and let them know WHAT WE THINK OF THE BILL and our WISH TO KILL IT!  Coming out strong in that regard will, at least, put the bastards on notice and let them know we want and deserve something BETTER!  We need to go on record!

Pelosi's P.O. sucked, big time.  SHE is the one who allowed the P.O. to be watered down to nothingness.  SHE!  Traitor Pelosi!  And, maybe, Obama was in there, too.  Who the hell knows?  So expand on Pelosi's P.O.?  That's rather humorous, if  you ask me!  

Proactive? Tell them to KILL THE BILL!  And if the GD thing goes through (most, assuredly, without a P.O. at all), then we refuse to buy and pay!

Fading for now!  Bonsoir!

 

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE


[ Parent ]
You're welcome! (4.00 / 2)
And go for it!

"Mientras el trabajo sea una comodidad, un mecanismo de extracción de plusvalía y un arma de alienación, el sistema y sus miserias sobrevivirán."  -Peter McLaren

[ Parent ]
Also, have you ever had a situation (4.00 / 2)
where a company or untility or whatever continually has and gives the wrong information pertaining to you or your account?  How many times did you write, call, do whatever to try and straighten it out?  How long did it take?  This is why we'd be better off with NO BILL than a rotten one.  Have we squared away the Patriot Act?  Etc., etc.

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE

[ Parent ]
letsgetitdone underestimates the power -- (4.00 / 2)
of the President side of the Force.  

"Mientras el trabajo sea una comodidad, un mecanismo de extracción de plusvalía y un arma de alienación, el sistema y sus miserias sobrevivirán."  -Peter McLaren

[ Parent ]
That was not exactly the point, but s'okay! (4.00 / 1)
I meant that there is a growing number, I think, who agree, we should kill the bill!

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE

[ Parent ]
Okay, a serious comment now. (4.00 / 1)
letsgetitdone needs to be able to show Jane Hamsher that the bill can be killed.  Just saying it won't be enough.  If he can show this, I'm sure Jane Hamsher would be delighted.

"Mientras el trabajo sea una comodidad, un mecanismo de extracción de plusvalía y un arma de alienación, el sistema y sus miserias sobrevivirán."  -Peter McLaren

[ Parent ]
cassiodorus -- I never said one way or the other what I thought (0.00 / 0)
the possibilities of "killing the bill" would be.  To me, it's the effort we should MAKE period.  You can kill even the ambition to "kill" something rotten by continually stating "it won't work unless and until . . . . !"  Always so easy to put "let's not do it obstacles in the way" -- there are ALWAYS obstacles to everything -- but, if we intend to "get it straight."  In a not so concise way, I'm trying to say that, sure, if you place enough "mental blocks" in the way -- nothing will work WITH anything!  

There may not and probably isn't a good chance of "killing this bill" (with the exception that Bernie Sanders will be fighting it tooth and nail -- blessings to him), but it should never deter US, no matter what, from doing the right thing. LET'S TRY AND GET THIS BILL KILLED FOR THE SAKE OF ALL OF US!  :)

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE


[ Parent ]
Okay, a serious comment now. (0.00 / 0)
letsgetitdone needs to be able to show Jane Hamsher that the bill can be killed.  Just saying it won't be enough.  If he can show this, I'm sure Jane Hamsher would be delighted.

"Mientras el trabajo sea una comodidad, un mecanismo de extracción de plusvalía y un arma de alienación, el sistema y sus miserias sobrevivirán."  -Peter McLaren

[ Parent ]
LOL! (4.00 / 1)
(I assumed you were speaking to me -- read too hastily!  When, in fact, I think you meant it for ALL here!)

Say "YES" to Generation We  Go there, read the Petition and sign, if you agree!   Say "YES" to GENERAL STRIKE

[ Parent ]
Reform Immigration -
March for America
Sunday, March 21
 

March on Washington
Saturday, March 20
 

 

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